BIN 1.6 uninstall problem - BIG problem!

[sniper297]

Potential disaster here. I had to fix trainsim yesterday (one of them widget errors), so I uninstalled BIN 1.6. Instead of the December 2001 train.exe, I got no train.exe at all! Fortunately I keep backups all over the place, so I copied a backup train.exe in - it was the only file missing. Okay, so I tried the uninstall again, which had worked flawlessly in previous versions. Same thing, train.exe was deleted and the original was NOT restored! Several repeats, same effect, no train.exe file. I'm using Patch 1.6.102213.exe, the uninstall is Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe. Anyone else confirm this?

[ianmacmillan]

Yep.

Happened to me as well.

I have a zipped up copy in my MSTS folder for these kind of problems.

I'm now using Otto's bat file to swap between different train.exe.

[rd4man]

Question regarding Uninstalling of the BIN patch: What if you have BIN installed in more than one "mini" route.....will it uninstall out of all of them? I would guess so as there's only one "MSTS Patch 1.6.0922" in the Add/Remove Program File.

As to your problem of the "lost" train.exe file; wouldn't a re-install of BIN take care of it?

[GaryG]

Mr Coconut Sir,

Was the registry pointing at the "TrainSim" installation you were trying to unstall MSTSbin from? I run mini routes and have had no problems (so far) removing MSTSbin when I wanted to try the original MSTS for that one route.

To answer a later post in this thread, it only uninstalls the one MSTSbin, not all. I think it is a necessity that the registry pointers (two of 'em) are set right to avoid problems.

GaryG

[Hobart]

Happened to me too, even though I thought I read over 30% of the readme.

[rd4man]

>
>To answer a later post in this thread, it only uninstalls the
>one MSTSbin, not all.

Still not sure I understand this, and I'm not going to test it, but in my case with BIN installed in four Mini routes (out of a dozen or so), if I were to go to the Control Panel and Remove the BIN patch, I would think it would remove ALL BIN patches from those four routes. It would have no way of selecting just one route??

[ChrisS68]

My understanding is that BIN is supposed to be removed via the executable in the Train Simulator folder, and not with Control Panel.

[sniper297]

"As to your problem of the "lost" train.exe file; wouldn't a re-install of BIN take care of it?"

No. The BIN installation checks for the correct version of train.exe, and if it doesn't find it the installation stops. Can't reinstall without the official patch version of train.exe (December 2001).

As for mini routes, couldn't tell you - I use routes on/off, only have one standard MSTS installation, never tried mini routes.

So where's Otto? Somebody needs to give George a headsup on this if everybody's getting it. I shudder to think how many are out there who didn't backup trainsim before installing 1.6.102213.

[pstraten]

Gee, Jim,

I've got several copies of the original train.exe on my hard drive. But this is sounding a little scary. Do I need anything else? Will I have to dust off those old CD's of MSTS? Guess this is a risk when you mess around with code you aren't privy to.

Where's Otto? Cranky as usual (well so am I) and probably enjoying a snifter or two! He can read the MSTSBin Forum on UK Trainsim with no problem, but I suppose he thinks it's not something he wants to bother with here.

Sorry Otto, mein lieber Freund, but I think you deserve that little dig!



PaulS

http://forums.flightsim.com/vbts/up1/67488.gif

[ChrisS68]

Is the BIN install not creating the backup(s) in the backup folder, or is it simply not restoring the file on uninstall?
OTOH, backing up files is recommendsd before installing BIN.

Chris

[rd4man]

>My understanding is that BIN is supposed to be removed via
>the executable in the Train Simulator folder, and not with
>Control Panel.

Ahhh.....THAT would take care of it. Glad I thought of that!!!

[pstraten]

There IS a train.0001 in the Bin backup files, but I expect that what Sniper has found is that it is not getting restored properly on an uninstall in this newest version.

At any rate, I ain't in the mood to experiment right now.

Backups? Well I guess that goes back to the days of cassette tape drives...I'll never forget the time my old dog got up from under the kitchen table and pulled the plug on the Commodore 64 after three hours of nonstop BASIC programming...



PaulS

http://forums.flightsim.com/vbts/up1/67488.gif

[sniper297]

Yeah, Paul, you got it. Except the train.001 isn't getting restored at all, let alone properly - not a corrupt or truncated train.exe, what you get is no train.exe at all.

Still had BIN Patch 1.6.092223.exe, tried that - works perfectly, install/uninstall a dozen times, MSTS still runs with or without.

Suppose I oughtta see if I can find what other files, if any, are going to the twilight zone. Can't be anything critical, cuz as soon as I copy the backup train.exe in MSTS will start.

[OTTODAD]

Sorry guys if I missed looking into the new MSTSBIN forum, THANK YOU JASON, but my son came over from the States to speak in a GARTNER SUSE LINUX Servers Summit conference this week and Thursday and Friday had free days I spent with him, having a Thanksgiving feast in my local Italian restaurant and some more good food at Mum's ! ;-)

MSTSBin 1.6.1 can be installed into any copy of MSTS, MINI or MAJOR, providing there is a 1.2/1.4 Train.exe in it and should not place itself into the Registry for it to show in Settings Add/Remove programs, I mentioned to George before.

No matter how many MSTSBin 1.6.1 MSTS copies are on your computer, it's Uninst_MSTS PATCH.....*.exe will only un-install the 1.6.1 train.exe in the same folder, restoring the previous files from it's MSTSBIN_BACKUP folder.

I have tested this a number of times in the past for various reasons and not once had a problem reverting to the previous train.exe.

If you do not have a 1.2/1.4 Train.exe then get another one from:
http://www.microsoft.com/games/trainsimulator/downloads.asp

O t t o

[sniper297]

Yeah, me too, Otto. Patch 1.6.092223.exe, and all previous versions, installed and uninstalled perfectly. The uninstall for Patch 1.6.102213.exe never works correctly, fails every time.

[GaryG]

Mr GofC,

I just uninstalled a mini install of "Patch 1.6.102213.exe" and train.exe was correctly reinstalled and MSTSbin was removed cleanly. I then reinstalled MSTSbin and again it was still ok. I did this twice.

To uninstall, I did use the "Uninst_MSTS_Patch 1.6.1022.exe" file that was in the mini install's "Train Simulator" directory. I also did have the Registry entries (2) pointing at that directory as well.

To confirm all was well, I started MSTS via a 'run' icon, started an activity then pressed F5 three times to confirm which train.exe was running. No, I didn't click my heels three times, this isn't Oz ;-)

Works fine here, perhaps my system is magical?

GaryG

[OTTODAD]

Same here. Did another test in my multi-routes 1.6.1 MINI just now and after using the 1.6.1022 un-installer all was back to 1.2/1.4 and working as it should and so was re-installing the 1.6.102213 path !

Any virus software running in the background which does not like executables being copied ?

O t t o

[rd4man]

>
>MSTSBin 1.6.1 can be installed into any copy of MSTS, MINI or
>MAJOR, providing there is a 1.2/1.4 Train.exe in it and should
>not place itself into the Registry for it to show in Settings
>Add/Remove programs, I mentioned to George before.
>

Otto,

Mine shows up in the Add/Remove Programs as:

MSTS Patch 1.6.0922

However, there is no File Size.

And, yes, I know, I have the earlier version of BIN installed, if that makes a difference.

[OTTODAD]

Hi J.B. !

I have one too, "last used" dated yesterday when I did a test un-install and re-install of 1.6.1, but there is no trace of it in the Registry.

So how would "Add or Remove" know which of the multiple installed copies of it should be un-installed ?

The only way to un-install MSTSBin 1.6 is to use it's Uninst_MSTS PATCH*.exe in the folder where it's associated Uninst_MSTS PATCH*.log is, the latter telling the un-installer what to remove and then restore from the MSTSBIN_BACKUP folder.

O t t o

[rd4man]

Well, I figured as much.....uninstall from within the associated route.....I was just wondering WHY it shows up in my Control Panel\Add-Remove Program area.

[dgauci]

>Hi J.B. !
>
>I have one too, "last used" dated yesterday when I did a test
>un-install and re-install of 1.6.1, but there is no trace of
>it in the Registry.
>
>So how would "Add or Remove" know which of the multiple
>installed copies of it should be un-installed ?

Because it is stored in the registry in the uninstall section!! I found it on mine with the following as it's uninstall string:

C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\Train Simulator\Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe /U "C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\Train Simulator\Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.log"

The path stored is going to be the last installed location.

The registry key on mine is named: {587A2120-41D3-11DB-3D6C-00E19E4D4AE1} which would make it kind of hard to find using regedit if you don't know it's keyname. Try doing a search in the registry for "MSTS Patch 1.6.1022" and you'll find it.

[OTTODAD]

Hi Dennis !

Because I have 9 MSTS copies of MSTSBin 1.5 and 1.6 I once checked which patch would be un-installed using "Add or Remove" and realized that there were numerous entries for patches, previous un-installers left behind, not using "Add or Remove" and deleted all the oddly named keys containing a reference to a MSTSBin patch.

That's when I told George about this and he did something to not have the installer add it into the Registry. 2 un-install and re-installs done yesterday have not created new entries in the Registry ?

My Registry now has neither an entry containing MSTS PATCH nor 1022.

O t t o

[sniper297]

Hmmm. Just did a virus scan a few days ago, now I wonder. Yesterday after reading Ottodad's post about not being able to duplicate, I ran the uninstall/reinstall about a dozen times, and guess what - couldn't duplicate! Converted train.exe back to December 2001 without a hiccup every time. The one thing it did NOT do was either back up or restore dialog.dll or string.dll, as you recall you're supposed to manually copy those from the translation folder, but when you uninstall the originals do not get restored automatically.

Dunno if that makes a difference, however - one oddball I ran across about a week ago was suddenly losing the #2 and #3 view long tethers - and in the F9 coupler window, the player engine was black, with a new type of wagon symbol I never saw before. I checked, and sure enough I had somehow lost the ability to switch cabs. That was when I first uninstalled and tried to reinstall and discovered the missing train.exe, when the reinstall wouldn't do it cuz it couldn't find any version of train.exe in the trainsim folder.

Today it happened again, I fired up the game and saw the F9 coupler window had lost the blue symbol for the player engine, and I could no longer change cabs. Looking at the trainsim folder, I saw that train.exe was dated December 11, 2001 now - how did that happen? Dunno, but went to reinstall without uninstalling - "You already have the latest BIN version installed". Hmmm, train.exe got the original date back, and lost the BIN features, but the installer is still reading it as the latest BIN version? Okay, so run the uninstall - train.exe vanishes without a trace, no version at all in the trainsim folder.

Gonna run Spybot and the Mcafee virus scanner tonight, I'll report back tomorrow.

[robertreedy]

Jim, probably a silly thought, but have you checked Spybots Quarantine folder? I don't know how much of SpyBot you are using, but I'm wondering if the Exe had been inoculated, then since it was changed with BIN that maybe Spybot flagged it as something irregular going on and moved it.

I've had it move a couple of dll's that way, but usually it asks or warns, but you never know. Just a thought.

RobertR
ADF-M&RM at http://www.adfrr.com
Cascade & North Western at http://www.vcnwrr.com/

[sniper297]

Don't think it could. I do have Mcafee virus shield running all the time because I have an always on cable modem, but I only run Spybot occasionally to check for problems Mcafee might miss. I don't have it running always in shield mode (immunize?). If Mcafee was the problem, you would think that it would object to the install, not the uninstall. Mcafee don't even blink when I run the install, so I suspect the BIN actually (1) checks for the presence of the 1.2 train.exe, (2) copies same to train.001, and (3) replaces train.exe with a new version. Rumor has it that BIN actually does not contain a train.exe, instead modifying the existing one on the fly to avoid piracy, but I strongly doubt that. If that was the case, any virus shield would scream like crazy about an EXE file being altered.

Just updated Spybot and ran the checker, came up with only the three usual - Windows antivirus, firewall, and auto update disabled (which are intentional and not actual problems).

[sniper297]

Okay, ran a complete virus scan last night, came up squeaky clean. So virus isn't it, gotta be something in the install. Corrupt patch executable? If that's it, why would it install okay, but screw up the uninstall? Anyone else have this?

[ianmacmillan]

It happened to me a few weeks ago.

Every time I started the computer train.exe1.6 was gone and the default one was in place.

Lasted about 3 days before settling down to 1.6.


I had a similar problem with dissapearing files a year ago after I downloaded a windows update.

Turned out to be Microsoft Malicious Software Removal Tool I had downloaded.

Again it cured itself after a few days.

[OTTODAD]

All this re-inforces my policy of never having my SIMS only computer connected to the Internet.

I can't even install MSFS-X De-Luxe on my other WIN-XP computer which has the required SR-2 update and a live Internet Broadband connection. Asking MSFS and the forums provided no solutions !

I shall wait for VISTA SR-1 and DirectX-10 and the next update for MSFS-X, the just released version according to the UK-Flightsim User Group not worth having in it's present state and inadequate performance on WIN-XP, even with the for it un-announced DirectX-9? update.

Will then shut down the Internet on it when not absolutely required for validations, etc, easily done by just closing down the ISP connection to it and if need be, pulling it's USB Broadband modem cable out it's socket on the computer. That's when I may transfer my MSTS and KRS over to it ?

Never buy the first of anything still seems to be the best ! ;-)

O t t o

[sniper297]

"All this re-inforces my policy of never having my SIMS only computer connected to the Internet."

Dunno, Otto, I don't think that's relevant. Like I said, I came up squeaky clean on viruses and spyware, so internet connection couldn't be a factor.

"Every time I started the computer train.exe1.6 was gone and the default one was in place.

Lasted about 3 days before settling down to 1.6."

Hmmm. Well, further testing shows that's exactly what I'm getting - install, works fine, reboot, old train.exe back again.

Just to check, I went to http://mstsbin.uktrainsim.com/eng/eng.html and downloaded the zip, extracted Patch 1.6.102213.exe to desktop, installed, checked okay, rebooted, December 2001 train.exe back again. I still have MSTSPatch1.6.092223.zip, that one don't do this.

Curious about "Lasted about 3 days before settling down to 1.6.", how did that work? You mean you reinstalled and rebooted for 3 days, or just left it alone with the 12/2001 train.exe for 3 days and the new 1.6 train.exe magically came back?

[ianmacmillan]

I only start my computer in the morning and leave it running all day.

At start up I just deleted the 1.2 train.exe and unzipped the 1.6 version.

Then one day it was back to normal before I could figure out what was happening.

[sniper297]

Yeah, I pretty much do the same - except when defragging or running a virus scan, for those I leave the computer on all night.

Gotta be something in the system registry or startup, here's what I did;

1. Copied 12/2001 train.exe in from backup.
2. Ran Patch 1.6.102213.exe, fired up game, changed engines to confirm 1.6 working.
3. Copied all 1.6 files and folders to backup.
4. Ran Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe.
5. Copied 1.6 files in from backup, fired up game, changed engines to confirm 1.6 working. Now I have a working 1.6 BIN, but nothing in registry indicating it's installed.
6. Rebooted - got 12/2001 train.exe back.

Okay, so:

1. copied 1.6 files in from backup, fired up game, changed engines to confirm 1.6 working.
2. Deleted Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe and Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.log from trainsim folder.
3. Rebooted - this time October 2006 train.exe present and correct.
4. Fired up game, changed engines to confirm 1.6 working.
5. Rebooted several more times to confirm that wasn't just a fluke.

Okay, so apparently something is autorunning Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe on rebooting, gotta chase that down now. Meantime, those who are having this problem:

1. Make damn sure you have a backup of the original 12/2001 train.exe before installing.
2. Install Patch 1.6.102213.exe.
3. Go into trainsim folder, translated DLLs folder, copy from your language folder dialog.dll and string.dll, paste into trainsim root folder.
4. Copy all root files plus;
1033
FONTS
GLOBAL
GUI
to a backup location.
5. Run Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe to clear from registry.
6. Copy all 1.6 files from backup into trainsim folder.
7. Delete Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe and Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.log from trainsim folder.

Having done that, it won't restore the 12/2001 train.exe when you reboot.

[OTTODAD]

Hi Jim !

When I said this: "All this re-inforces my policy of never having my SIMS only computer connected to the Internet." I meant that in doing so I do not need any SP-1, SP-2, firewalls, virus, spyware and other malware checkers and only basic MSTS Services are running, so that all of my machine's resources are at the disposal of MSTS and nothing but myself can interfere with it. ;-)

"Every time I started the computer train.exe 1.6 was gone and the default one was in place.

There is something on your computer doing this, not likely to happen on mine ! The Registry has no record of anything MSTSBin 1.6 related to act on Start-Up, so what is causing this "MSTS System Restore" ?

Next time it does it again do a Start / Run msconfig and check what it running on Startup !

O t t o

[sniper297]

Good idea, but no joy. Nothing in startup, winini, sysini, services, or add/remove programs. Dunno what this is:

http://forums.flightsim.com/vbts/up1/113165.jpg

But I don't think that's it either. Oddly, after running Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe it stays in the registry, dunno why.

Anyway, for my next trick I copied Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe and Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.log back into \Train Simulator, ran the Uninst_MSTS Patch 1.6.1022.exe - then shut down to cold iron. Started back up again, ran the Patch 1.6.102213.exe to reinstall, and then shut down to cold iron again. Booted up again, this time I still had the 1.6 train.exe. Several warm reboots and a couple more cold iron restarts later, problem seems to be gone altogether. Oddball thing, Ian and I are the only ones out of umpteen thousand users who got this?!

OT, only thing I ran across during my system hunt was something called "My Way Search Assistant" in the add/remove programs list. Clicked on the support link, Netscape immediately started yelling about "this website has been tagged as a spyware site". Curious that that had been installed and neither Mcafee nor Spybot caught it, unless Netscape is hollering wolf. Never noticed it before, because the blasted add/remove program list is inundated with all these google shockwave quicktime realplayer viewpoint etcetera - seems like every video on the internet requires their own brand of video player installed to view the video, so these days I just skip viewing videos on the web. x( Probably not related to this anyway.

[Turbo Bill]

I just checked my Train Exe date and it shows the created date of Sunday, September 10, 2006, 2:36:19 AM but the version listed at te top is 1.4. I have installed the patch and uninstalled it several times since then but have it installed and not messed with it in the last week or so. Does the version number change to 1.6 when the correct Train exe is in the MSTS folder?

[tpilot]

If I remember correctly, if you right click Train.exe it will say 1.4 at the top, but the version line down below in properties will say 1.6.102xx sth. Ottodad posted a screengrab of it previously in one of the threads.

[Turbo Bill]

Thanks, I'll check it out.

[sniper297]

You have an earlier version, MSTSPatch1.6.092223. That one had no problems, the one that was reverting is 1.6.102213, train.exe dated October 21, 2006.

[OTTODAD]

Hi Jim !

Nobody seems to have a clear cut explanation for what the purpose and function of this MUICACHE is, I have known to record most recent used applications and processes.

This thread indicates that it can be used by Trojans and Dialers to start whatever and appears to be another of the many holes in the MS Swiss Emmenthal Cheese code !

http://www.forensicfocus.com/index.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=3325

Did another check in the Registry, realizing that the last one I did forgot to untick "Match whole string only" and of course found no reference to a string containing "1.6.1022". This time it found numerous entries, including this one below I am going to ask George what it's purpose is !

Cleared the Registry of all MSTSBin entries and no ill effect !

O t t o

http://forums.flightsim.com/vbts/up1/113199.jpg

[OTTODAD]

Found out what all these mysterious Registry entries are !

They are ROT-13 encrypted records of when programs have been used last and how many times. Another form of MS spying on what users are doing on their machines and together with the MRU cashes doing similar, adding bloat to the Registry, slowing access to it down.

Makes you wonder what the ultimate purpose of all this stored data is, of no interest to the computer user, but somehow accessed by Microsoft when the computer is connected to it via the Internet ? x(

Below is part of the decrypted entries.

O t t o

http://forums.flightsim.com/vbts/up1/113241.jpg

[GaryG]

Hi OttO

That info is useful to defraggers when they decide where on the drive is the 'best' location for files.

GaryG

[OTTODAD]

Hi Gary !

I don't think that defragging a hard disk or it's drives involves the Registry, which has no record of where all the data used by programs is stored.

The location of all data segments and their links to others is recorded in the File Allocation Table as used by NTFS or FAT-32, which is what the defragger reads before deciding what to do with them !

O t t o

[tpilot]

Gary is probably correct on this one.

Otto is correct that the location of the data segments in recorded in the FAT; however, a number of Defraggers will sort the data and put most often accessed data at the beginning (center) of the disk for faster access. (Along with frequently changed data at the end of the disk, etc.) I am pretty sure Raxco Perfect Disk does this, and probably others as well.

I didn't know they got the info from MUIcache, but it would make sense.

[OTTODAD]

For those who are interested in what the purpose of all these UserAssist Registry entries is, George supplied this link:
http://personal-computer-tutor.com/abc3/v29/vic29.htm

Nothing to worry me, my WIN-XP Sims Only computer not being accessed by anybody but me ! ;-)

O t t o

[GaryG]

Thanks for that well researched answer Otto,

GaryG