Dual core CPU support

[Fodda]

I run a PC that's nearly 18 months old, so not the most up to date system at all. It came with a dual core 6600 Intel CPU. I used to be able to run KRS with my RailDriver console on this PC until I had to reinstall the whole lot thanks to the Mk 2 update from Kuju.

Now I get this godawful 20-30 second delay between using a control (any) on my RailDriver and the thing responding.

I've NOT changed ANY hardware between it working and not working. I've not installed anything except KRS etc. all of which were working fine before.

Why in this age of multi-core processors as standard does my RailDriver console suddenly not work with KRS any more? It's quoted on your website as being a known problem... What are you doing to fix it?

[rdamurphy]

Sounds a lot to me like there's two drivers installed, you might want to check your Control Panel... Although most of the time it won't show it. I'd try a driver removal tool to get rid of all of the current drivers completely, then try re-installing.

Robert

Robert

[Fodda]

OK, I'll give that a whirl once I get home. Cheers... Fingers crossed that'll fix it.

[Fodda]

So, it makes no difference at all. KRS still sufferes from an awful 20-30 second lag between setting the control and the software responding. And I don't use MSTS as my monitor is widescreen and the Radildriver software can't decipher the F5 text any more. This leaves me with KRS and my RD console...

And this multi-core processor problem was known about and mentioned LONG before I suffered my woes.

Is there a patch going to come out to fix this RD issue? Will I ever be able to use my very expensive controller again? And why won't PI come along and try and help? I'm not the only person who upgraded their PC to multi-core functionality in the last 5 years or so.

[djt1]

So, it makes no difference at all. KRS still sufferes from an awful 20-30 second lag between setting the control and the software responding.

And this multi-core processor problem was known about and mentioned LONG before I suffered my woes.




No “20-30 second lag” here with Rail Driver and KRS with an Intel dual core E8600 or my quad core Q9650.

I’ve used the Rail Driver with XP/SP3 and Vista 64/SP1 and neither of my two machines with the above mentioned multi-core processors exhibits any problems with the controller.

How up to date is you’re OS, there have been various Windows updates that have addressed multi-core issues with both XP and Vista. Vista SP1 and XP SP3 both also contain multi-core CPU updates.

[ckawahara]

....I’ve used the Rail Driver with XP/SP3 and Vista 64/SP1 and neither of my two machines with the above mentioned multi-core processors exhibits any problems with the controller......

How was RD installed on the Vista OS pc? I've never been able to get the .dll's to properly register in the registry.

[djt1]

How was RD installed on the Vista OS pc? I've never been able to get the .dll's to properly register in the registry.

All I did was run the exe, plug it in and let Windows recognize the controller, go through the calibration process and fire up Rail Sim, no problems.

[Fodda]

Like I put in the first post, it USED to work fine until I updated KRS. PI have already said there may be a lag problem with multi-core CPUs.

I'd just like somebody from PI to tell me what they're doing about this. Multi-core CPUs are the norm nowadays, and I spent a small fortune on the RD hardware. I DON'T want to think I spent all that cash on something that's not supported any more.

Come on PI, it's been months with no word at all. This kind of customer support is terrible, and I certainly won't be recommending the company to anyone. Quite the reverse in fact if you insist on just ignoring enormous problems with your products.

[djt1]

Like I put in the first post, it USED to work fine until I updated KRS. PI have already said there may be a lag problem with multi-core CPUs.




I’m using Rail Sim with the Mk2 update with Vista 64/SP1 on two systems, one using a Core 2 Duo and one using a Core 2 Quad. As I said before I have no lag issues with Rail Driver.

[rdamurphy]

Have you asked PI Engineering, Raildriver's manufacturer?

They can probably come up with a solution, I severely doubt it has anything to do wtih a Core 2 Duo, more than likely it involves the wide screen monitor...

Have you tried any of the solutions found here: http://www.raildriver.com/support/raildriver.php?

Robert

[djt1]

Now I get this godawful 20-30 second delay between using a control (any) on my RailDriver and the thing responding.

I severely doubt it has anything to do wtih a Core 2 Duo, more than likely it involves the wide screen monitor...

We never got a detailed description of the “godawful 20-30 second delay” but yes a VA panel LCD does have very high input lag (high latency in screen update).

[Rick-MONON]

Good luck on getting a response................
Try starting msts, then go to task manager, right click on train.exe and rail driver, set to affinity I believe, I am not at home now, sorry, and uncheck the 2d processor, the bottom one, then do the same but go to Priority and set to high, you will get a warning but disregard the warning.

[djt1]

Try starting msts, then go to task manager, right click on train.exe and rail driver, set to affinity I believe, I am not at home now, sorry, and uncheck the 2d processor, the bottom one, then do the same but go to Priority and set to high, you will get a warning but disregard the warning.


I think the problem is with Rail Simulator not MSTS -

I used to be able to run KRS with my RailDriver console on this PC until I had to reinstall the whole lot thanks to the Mk 2 update from Kuju.
Now I get this godawful 20-30 second delay between using a control (any) on my RailDriver and the thing responding.


If the OS is up to date with the latest service pack and Windows updates the OS shouldn’t have any problem managing multiple cores without forcing one core on an application.

[RailDriver_Rocco]

Fodda

Do you have the MK1 and MK2 updates installed? The MK2 update should have resolved any multi-core issues.

If these updates are installed try the following:

-Close RDMWII from the icon tray next to the time.
-Go into Add or Remove programs and uninstall RailDriver MWII and reboot.
-Once the computer is up and running install the RailDriver MWII from this link:
http://www.raildriver.com/assets/downloads/rdrs.exe
-When finished run RDMWII from your desktop and see if you get the same issue.

[Fodda]

OK Rocco, here we go.

I have the Mk 1 and 2 updates.

I've tried your fix listed above and it still has the lag.

Now for more interesting findings.

1. On reinstalling from your link, there was an error toward the end of the install about not being able to open raildriver.dll for writing. This could well be the problem maybe.

2. I copied the raildriver.dll file from the Rail Simulator/plugins folder into the RailDriver MWII folder, just in case it needed to be there.

3. I ran the RD calibration tool and that seemed to work fine.

4. I editted the ReportConfig.txt file as I still get the AngelScript error even though it's an old problem that's easily fixed by PI. After my edit I don't get the AngelScript error any more.

5. Most interestingly, I can press the RailDriver Run/Stop button on the console and notice that over 50% of my CPU is running and the lag means that it takes 20-30 secs for the console to respond. Same for turning it off as well. This is all without Rail Sim even running.

6. Task Manager shows RDMWII.exe *32 hogging 50% of my CPU capacity, even after I've closed RD software in the TakBar!

I didn't make the RD, I've not read or written the code. I think I've done as much as I can to fix this problem (as well as find and publish a fix for the AngelScript problem). All I want is to be able to use my £140 bit of hardware for the purpose it was made.

Multi-core CPUs aren't a flash in the pan that PI can stick its head in the sand and pretend will go away soon. This is a known problem, and I'd like some kind of solution please.

What changed? RD console worked fine UNTIL I installed the Mk2 patch! And this has all been covered in my previous posts. I think I've told everyone enough info about this problem to get some kind of official message. Who is there from PI that reads this forum? Is there an official PI forum I can post my problem to? Are PI even going to release some kind of patch to fix the AngelScript error?

I'm really NOT impressed with the service from PI.

[djt1]

I think I've told everyone enough info about this problem

You have? What are your exact system specs including the monitor?

If this is such a well known problem then how do you explain that I have no lag with Rail Driver and Rail Sim on Windows XP or Vista running on Core 2 dual core and quad core CPU’s?

[Fodda]

What difference would my monitor make?

Monitor: Iiyama E1900WS (19" widescreen)

MoBo: Asus P5N-E SLI
CPU: Intel Dual Core 6600
RAM: 2GB DDR2
GPU: 1 x 8800GTX 768 MB
HDD: 1 x 500 GB 7200 rpm, 1 x 250 GB 7200 rpm
OS: Windows Vista HP 64 bit

RailDriver software version: 1.0.1.2

ANY help appreciated. I want to get all this working. And I'm not the first to suffer from this problem.

[djt1]

What difference would my monitor make?


The monitor can make a big difference; take a look through this guide. Take note of some of the weaknesses in certain panel types. You will see one of those weaknesses is high input lag (high latency in screen update) a common problem with some monitors.


http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=31&threadid=2049206&enterthread=y


And I'm not the first to suffer from this problem.

You are not the first to suffer from many issues that users mention in this forum. Most of the problems have nothing to do with the software but with other issues that are system specific. Lack of system maintenance and usually a botched OS is to blame.

Like I said I’ve installed and reinstalled the Rail Driver software since its release on two different machines with multi-core processors and have not experienced any lag what so ever with Rail Sim.

What condition is your OS in? Are you up to date with SP1 and the latest updates?

I’m using Rail Driver with Rail Sim “lag” free on the two systems listed below.




Nvidia Gaming:

ASUS RAMPAGE FORMULA (Intel X48 chipset) BIOS 0601
Intel Core 2 Duo E8600 w/Thermalright Ultra-120 eXtreme
OCZ Titanium XTC 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
EVGA GTX 280 FTW (180.43 Drivers)
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
2x Western Digital Raptor 74GB (RAID 0) - Vista Ultimate 64 Bit/SP1
SILVERSTONE 1200Watt DA
SILVERSTONE TJ09-B



ATI Gaming:

ASUS Rampage Extreme BIOS 0701
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 w/Thermalright Ultra-120 eXtreme
OCZ Intel Extreme Edition 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
ATI 4870X2 (Catalyst Hotfix 8.55.1.)
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
2x Western Digital Raptor 74GB (RAID 0) - Vista Ultimate 64 Bit/SP1
PC Power & Cooling T1KWSR 1000W
LIAN LI PC-A70B

[Fodda]

I'm not wading through all that monitors website, I'm an electronics engineer by trade with years of PC building experience behind me... How on earth does my monitor make the RD console lag by 20 to 30 seconds? What possible connection can there be between them?

The ONLY thing that lags on my PC is the RD console. I'm playing Far Cry 2 with all sliders set to maximum and getting perfectly smooth gameplay. I play Call Of Duty 4 with all the settings to max, both in single player and online... Again with perfectly smooth gameplay and instant response from keyboard and mouse. I regularly use Flight Sim 9 and Flight Sim X, with TrackIR AND an X50 HOTAS joystick setup with plenty of graphics and AI... Again Smoooooooth! How about playing GTR2 and GT Legends with a MoMo wheel and pedals setup... Again max graphics settings and 60 fps or thereabouts?

Now I ask again, what would my monitor do to a RailDriver input console, that it's not doing to any of that?

I have Vista fully up to date and patched, and as I've hinted above I'm perfectly happy with how everything else runs.

PI engineers posted that there was a lag problem with some dual core CPU systems on their own website. Since then I've heard nothing from anyone from PI!

Why doesn't anyone from PI respond to this problem or my continual posting here? I've supplied enormous amounts of information about my system, the problem and the history of the problem in this thread alone. Is nobody at PI interested in it?

[djt1]

I'm not wading through all that monitors website, I'm an electronics engineer by trade with years of PC building experience behind me... How on earth does my monitor make the RD console lag by 20 to 30 seconds? What possible connection can there be between them?
Now I ask again, what would my monitor do to a RailDriver input console, that it's not doing to any of that?

10-15 minutes of research on-line will tell you how a certain LCD panel monitors can have lag with input devices.

Since you seem to know more about the subject than AnandTech or any of the other hardware sites, maybe you should go over to those forums and teach them a thing or two, LOL.


I have Vista fully up to date and patched, and as I've hinted above I'm perfectly happy with how everything else runs.


You’re perfectly happy with how everything else runs but if it’s not your monitor causing the issue than there is obviously something that is not “happy” with the rest of your system.

On a clean OS with all the latest Windows updates including Vista SP1, with all the latest drivers for my hardware, I’m having no problems what so ever with Rail Driver and Intel’s dual or quad core processors.

[rdamurphy]

Well, since you're an engineer...

MSTS, nor RS have an API, and there are no exposed processes that can be hooked to determine the response from the sim. Therefore, PI used an OCR routine to read the information off of the screen as it was output by the game. SINCE your monitor is an odd shape, and stretches the game out of proper proportion, obviously, the OCR is having a difficult time deciphering the alpha-numeric outputs on your screen, and is calling the same routine over and over until it gets a decipherable result. Therefore, the lag, or delay.

Now, a typical engineer would troubleshoot this problem by using a different screen resolution, a different monitor, especially a CRT, and different game resolution settings to determine the optimimum combination to present the OCR with the most efficient input.

Robert

[djt1]

Well, since you're an engineer...

MSTS, nor RS have an API, and there are no exposed processes that can be hooked to determine the response from the sim. Therefore, PI used an OCR routine to read the information off of the screen as it was output by the game.


Robert,

The information does not have to be read off the screen with RailSim for Rail Driver to work like it did with MSTS. Rail driver works with Rail Sim the same way it worked with Trainz/TRS.

[Fodda]

LOL... Thanks Robert. I did know that MSTS wouldn't work because of the screen stretching, which is why I've uninstalled the lot and now only want to use Rail Sim, which DOES have some kind of API. At least RS reads the info directly from the RD console and doesn't need to read the screen. I think I've written about it being Rail Sim I'm using in this forum a few times now. A typical forum reader would go through the thread before making such a bold comment. ;-) ;-)

djt1: Thanks for the help, I know you can run RD and RS on your multi core systems. I used to be able to run mine properly until I installed the Mk2 patch. I brought up the multi core problem because PI have actually published the fact that SOME multi core systems will experience this exact same lag bug as I'm experiencing. My frustration comes from the fact that lots of well meaning people like yourself and Robert are doing their best to help me out, whilst nobody from PI (who ought to know the software and hardware better than most) has said a thing here.

I'll keep trying, as long as I'm not seduced too often by the urge to play Far Cry 2.

[Fodda]

OK... I'm back.

If anyone's still reading this, I've got an idea.

I had an eror when installing the RD software. "Error opening file for writing: \plugins\RailDiver.dll"

This is the dll file held in the Ral Simulator plugins folder.

The date of my raildriver.dll file is 14 August 2008, size 56.0 kB.

The same error message appears whether I leave raildriver.dll in the plugins folder or not.

I've checked the complete Rail Simulator folder struture, and it shows the lot as Read Only. No matter how I try though, I can't disable that flag.

djt1... Is your copy of raildriver.dll later than mine? If so, might you be willing to email me a copy of it please?

[djt1]

djt1... Is your copy of raildriver.dll later than mine? If so, might you be willing to email me a copy of it please?

The RailDriver.dll in my Rail Simulator/plugins folder is dated 8/13/2008.

[Fodda]

Ho hum. Oh well... That's a bit weird. I was hoping you'd have a later one that worked. Never mind, I'm totally fed up with this whole thread and lack of response from anyone at PI.

I give up. I'm now the owner of £150 worth of plastic, metal and electronic uselessness.

I'll stick to flight sims, at least Saitek and Logitech have cutomer support. :-(

Thanks for trying to help anyway.